Stuff
New episode should be up tomorrow. If it's not email Erik :)We're scheduled to have our Altadis rep on the show tomorrow night so if you have any questions about Altadis (RyJ, Trinidad, SLR, Juan Lopez, Montecristo, etc) post them here. We record the show at 8PM Central Time so I'll check at 8 to see if there are any questions.
posted by Josh @ 11:01 PM
17 Comments:
I have a question... other than the Edicion Limitada Romeo y Julieta, is Altadis going to be joining in on the Corojo wrapper trend that has become popular over the last two years?
That segment with "Doc" was really interesting--I've heard all sorts of things regarding cigars & health, and I don't know what to believe anymore. I've heard that you can decrease the carcinogenic properties of cigars if you keep it out of your mouth (no chompin') between puffs, and if you drink something non-or-low alcoholic content alongside the cigar.
I'd love to hear more about this stuff--was it in the "lost" episode? What dosages of zinc, vitamin B3, and C are safe?
Get "Doc" back on to talk more about this stuff!
All right, I surrender. Where is episode 32? I click on the link and get episode 1. Are you gus just toying with us?
There should be dropdown window that pops up where you can scroll to select which episode you download. This is about half way down the page in a section called Episodes
I hope this helps.
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Good show, BUT... It's a shame that your guest, this "Doc" fellow, isn't a proper medical doctor, but a doctor of Chiropractic.
When he started spouting off all of the "what dentist's can't tell you," and, "FDA blah blah drug companies and vaccines blah," it became abundantly clear that I couldn't continue listening without fact-checking a lot of his claims.
Here's what the data actually says about Mercury in amalgam fillings:
http://www.quackwatch.com/01QuackeryRelatedTopics/mercury.html
Oral Galvanism (and I couldn't find any studies that supported his claim that oral galvanism has in fact fried anyones brain stem):
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/sites/entrez?cmd=Retrieve&db=PubMed&list_uids=8362203&dopt=AbstractPlus
And if you're wondering about Chiropractic:
http://www.quackwatch.com/01QuackeryRelatedTopics/chiro.html
I'm a bit skeptical myself regarding chiropractic too, and some of the non-cigar related stuff regarging the mercury fillings sounded inaccurate. However it was mentioned--by Josh, I guess--that "Doc" was also a neurologist; that part lends more cred. I figured that "Doc" was giving information in an informal way, based on what he talks about with colleagues and peers who are established medical doctors and dentists. Just his two cents--you certainly have to make your own decisions re: health based on weighing all evidence and multiple authorities.
I'd still like to hear more about cigars & health related issues. I'm a lightweight and get sick easy from smoking just a 1/2 of an Arturo Fuente (e.g., Hemingway or reg. maduros)--NO I DON'T INHALE! I want to know ways I can smoke in moderation but avoid nicotine sickness and long-term illness.
Hey Vic,
He actually presented himself as a Chiropractic Neurologist... which is a 'specialty' of chiropractic.
As a Dermatologist is a medical doctor specializing in skin, 'chiropractic neurologists' are a subset of chiropractors that specialize in the same sort of quack nonsense (from HolisticJunction.com):
"Chiropractic Neurology practitioners use "afferent stimulation," which is composed of non-invasive and non-surgical treatment procedures. These treatments may include brain exercises, chiropractic adjustments, electric stimulation, heat,light, sound and water."
Take that, Pan Encephalitis. You too, Alzheimer's.
I'm sure he's a nice guy and all... But seeing as how he believes that a spine adjustment can unblock the natural flow of my life energy, and thereby cure most diseases (some go as far as to deny GERM THEORY)... I'm just not going to trust him as a reputable source for proper health advice... or for anything, really.
Well, to be fair, "Doc" didn't explicitly say he believed or practiced any of the pseudoscientific junk that the HolisticJunction.com description gives of his profession. I'll give him the benefit of the doubt and hope he's one of the "good ones" that Quackwatch regards as ethical and efficacious (see http://www.chirobase.org/13RD/chiroguidelines.html).
Certainly some of the suggestions he gave regarding the need to monitor your oral health due to special acids in cigars were right on the money--at least my own dentist said the same things to me when I told him I was smoking cigars.
Hey, on a totally different side-note: When's Erik coming back??! He's cool, collected, and a nice balancing element to the podcast!
In Doc's defense, I was actually there during the taping of the show and I gotta say that in my opinion, he's not some quack doctor out there on a soap box trying to get everyone to harness their chee and all that other BS. Instead, he seemed like a genuinely nice guy trying to pass on some of his knowledge so that others can take some practical steps to improving their cigar experience. Not once do I recall him saying, "You should subscribe to this type of thought," be it medical or otherwise.
At any rate, as with everything else, you have to take it with a grain of salt and decide for yourself what you want to believe.
Vic:
Oh, I agree that he was right on the money on some of his advice. But where he was wrong, he was VERY wrong. And there's a whole lot of data that shows that he's wrong.
As far as giving him the benefit of the doubt... I'm afraid I can't do that based on some of what he said. Plus, one of the things he did advocate was the use of herbs in preventing or treating gum disease... in contrary to the article you cited on Quackwatch.
Cory:
I completely agree with you. He does sound like a nice guy and didn't try to cram anything down my throat.
But he was on a podcast I really like talking about certain issues that had nothing to do with what he was there to talk about, which happened to be incorrect statements that are in line with what a lot of people in his questionable profession believe.
Next week it will be tequila if that will make you guys happier!!!
This is Doc, but it may be published as m. I guess even I get 15 minutes of fame. I am immensely pleased that the show has sparked discussion-it is the American way. When I do professional presentations, I have time to build a case with references and I am able to speak efficiently in the language of neurology and biochemistry, which has precise meaning, otherwise each lecture would require the teaching of all of physics and chemistryI can understand why listeners could be wanting for more specifics from this format, after all it is media. to keep this short, I will now address the foundation of the objections, and leave the specifics in the interest of time for later, because I am behind the eight ball if my very profession is not considered legitimate. The show is for a lay public, and the desire was to call attention to risk factors and possible solutions which are not fully clear yet. As a clinician, I have pressure daily to help sick people, whether the science is rock solid or not. We can spend more time later on those specific objections, but chiropractic itself and quackwatch must be addressed first. The US government through the US Dept of Education accredits chiropractic colleges through the CCE, Council on chiropractic Education, similar to the medical profession. Medicare pays for chiropractic adjustments. The NIH National Institutes of Health spends millions at chiropractic campuses on research into chiropractic effects on humans and animals. Much is known, but it is very dry and not amenable to a podcast. Nobel prizes were won in neurology and biochemistry during the 1990s which was the decade of the brain according to NIH, which are the scientific foundation for many of our treatments. Certainly there are questionable treatments and views held in the profession, but we all do not subscribe to them. Medical knowledge doubles every 15 months and it takes 17 years for new research to trickle into medical and chiropractic colleges. In the 1980's a group of chiropractors sued the AMA and proved in federal court under Justice Susan Getzendanner that the AMA was conspiring to unscientifically under illegal restraint of trade statutes including the Sherman Antitrust Act "contain and eliminate" many professions, including chiropractic. They were ordered to stop the illegal slander against DCs and to pay millions in damages. Two men ran the precursor to quackwatch, and have been debunked live in courts of law by chiropractors and biochemists I know personally, and struck down by Justice Getzendanner. Science is not on one side or the other, and the questions and answers are often deeper than they appear. There are basic assumptions constantly being overturned that are used against alternative medical treatments, and I object to generalizations that because I stated advocacy for some that I believe blindly in all. Keep the questions coming, I tell all my patients and my students (I was a clinical professor for years) to question everything that comes out of my mouth and all doctors mouths. My only regret is that we all are not sitting together with a stogie discussing these controversial subjects live, with a whiteboard to illustrate concepts and the time to quote peer reviewed references and deeply challenge each other constructively. Sorry for the length of this commentary.
Wow, this is awesome! I'm glad we are getting some discussions here.
First of all, rubio, you are right...Doc is not a "proper medical doctor", he is a Chiropractor with a doctorate in Neurology. If I was shot three times in the arm, of course I would never see a Chiropractor...that is not what they do. But to say that all they do is Quackery is not right.
I can speak from personal experience that that Chiropractic care can make a huge positive impact on someone's life. I have Tourette Syndrome, and these "brain exercises, chiropractic adjustments, electric stimulation, heat,light, sound and water" have actually made my life better. I have noticed less symptoms and a longer attention span. I actually read books now. I was never able to sit down and read before.
Please keep the questions/comments coming. "Doc" will be in Amsterdam for the next couple of weeks attending clinics, but I am sure he would love to answer all questions and concerns you all may have when he gets back.
Rock on
I appreciate Doc's comments -- I don't think there was any intention that he had to defend himself formally. However, I also understand rubio's concerns here too -- as a scientist myself, w/ a Ph.D. in experimental psychology, I understand the importance of checking all facts and considering the source for accuracy.
On the other hand, consider the forum: I did assume Doc was speaking "from the hip", based on what he knows and has heard. I'm not considering it an official prescription for prevention and/or treatment--he was informal (like the podcast, which makes it so cool and laid back).
Chiropractic aside, Doc may have worthwhile insight, experience, and information to share--certainly, take what he (or Josh, or Bob, or whoever else) with a grain of salt. Hell, I'd love to hear from anyone and everyone with more experience with cigar smoking about their preventitives or remedies for nicotine sickness! There's not a lot of info available online about this--I've checked, and mostly the only thing you get is 'abstinence education'! I want to smoke my cigars and decrease my likelihood of sickness (both short and long-term)!
I am curious, where is episode 33? After having you guys comment on how fun it was, I have yet to see it available...just giving you guys some crap, looking forward to the tequila commentary, especially after Josh gave me crap about asking what tequila would best match my choice in cigar...
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